Illia Polosukhin, Alex & Anton: Why Confidential AI Is The Next Big Shift
Illia Polosukhin, Alex & Anton: Why Confidential AI Is The Next Big Shift
Podcast55 min 18 sec
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Note: AI-generated summary based on third-party content. Not financial advice. Read more.
Quick Insights

The strongest actionable theme is privacy-focused crypto, with ZEC positioned as an early leader; monitor whether privacy features translate into sustained usage, as no price target or timeframe was provided. Treat NEAR as a higher-risk, adoption-dependent opportunity: watch for measurable growth in NEAR Intents activity and recurring demand from AI agents before relying on the proposed token-utility thesis. For AI infrastructure, track adoption of private, verifiable inference and independently validate the team’s cost and performance claims before investing. The discussion offers no specific buy/sell recommendation or near-term catalyst for BTC, GOOGL, AMZN, META, or stablecoins.

Detailed Analysis

NEAR (NEAR)

  • The NEAR team presented the network as infrastructure for confidential finance, AI agents, and cross-network trading. Its “market of markets” approach is intended to connect liquidity and services across crypto assets, AI models, and agent-based commerce.
  • NEAR Intents was described as a source of revenue and a way to let users express a desired outcome—such as making a trade or purchasing a service—without navigating each underlying system themselves.
  • The team said agents could have reasons to hold NEAR: to access AI compute, establish reputation, and provide security deposits that could be slashed for misconduct. These are presented as potential components of an agent economy, not as established demand.
  • The discussion also described revenue and possible buybacks as ways to support the network’s utility economy, but gave no figures or firm commitment.
  • NEAR’s account model was said to make it easier to add new cryptographic signing schemes. The team said it had rolled out support for ML-DSA-65 and characterized NEAR as better positioned than some older chains, particularly Bitcoin, to adapt to post-quantum cryptography.

Takeaways

  • The bullish thesis depends on NEAR turning its infrastructure into sustained use: more trading activity through Intents, demand for AI inference, and agents using the network.
  • Track whether the proposed token roles—compute access, agent reputation, and security deposits—become real, recurring sources of demand.
  • The team acknowledged that preparing for cryptographic threats will require significant work. Its post-quantum flexibility is a stated advantage, but does not eliminate the risk of a major cryptographic failure.

Zcash (ZEC)

  • Zcash was described as having led the recent wave of interest in financial privacy and as an example of personal sovereignty.
  • The NEAR team said NEAR Intents had helped unlock parts of the Zcash ecosystem and build economic functions around it.
  • The discussion linked privacy demand to both individual users, who may not want their spending exposed, and businesses, which may not be able to disclose payments, payroll, or financial statements publicly.

Takeaways

  • The discussion is bullish on the privacy theme, with Zcash cited as an early leader. The investment case presented is that privacy may become more useful as crypto moves beyond speculation toward business and everyday financial activity.
  • Watch for evidence that privacy features lead to broader use and economic activity. The transcript did not provide a price target, timeline, or specific recommendation for ZEC.

Bitcoin (BTC)

  • Bitcoin was mentioned in comparison with NEAR’s ability to add new signing schemes. NEAR’s representative said NEAR is better positioned than Bitcoin for a potential post-quantum transition because of its account model.
  • This was a claim about relative technical preparedness, not a broader assessment of Bitcoin’s investment prospects.

Takeaways

  • The discussion raises post-quantum readiness as a factor investors may want to monitor across blockchain networks.
  • It does not establish that Bitcoin faces an imminent quantum threat or offer a specific view on BTC’s price.

Confidential AI and AI inference infrastructure

  • The NEAR team argued that AI should protect the privacy of prompts and user data, and that AI outputs should be verifiable—including evidence about the model and hardware used.
  • The team described a service for running open-weight models with encryption and attestations, and plans to support third-party model providers without exposing model weights or user data to each other.
  • DeepSeek-like open-weight models were described as gaining usage because they are cheaper and more accessible. One speaker claimed a customized model and harness could match Claude and GPT on a formal-verification task at 100 to 200 times lower cost; this was a company representative’s example, not a general benchmark.
  • The speakers argued that agent-driven commerce could challenge existing business models built around sponsored search results and other forms of advertising.

Takeaways

  • The opportunity discussed is broader than any single model: it includes private inference, model hosting, verification, and tools that help AI agents take actions.
  • The transcript’s cost and performance comparisons are claims from the NEAR team. Treat them as hypotheses to verify against independent benchmarks and actual customer adoption.
  • Relevant risks raised in the discussion include exposure of sensitive personal or business data, manipulation through AI systems, and the possibility that model providers may restrict agent access or control how agents interact with services.

Google (GOOGL), Amazon (AMZN), and Meta (META)

  • These companies were discussed as examples of how AI agents could pressure established business models—not as specific stock recommendations.
  • The speakers argued that AI-generated answers could disrupt Google’s search-advertising model and that agents may not respond to sponsored placements in the same way people do.
  • Amazon was cited as an example of a business that could be affected if agents bypass sponsored search results or change how customers find and buy products.
  • Meta was mentioned in connection with the tension between promoting privacy and potentially using advertising within AI products.

Takeaways

  • The discussion suggests a potential business-model risk for companies that rely on advertising, sponsored placement, or human attention to monetize digital services.
  • It does not establish how quickly this disruption will occur or quantify its effect on earnings. Investors should distinguish the long-term scenario described from evidence of current financial impact.
  • No specific stock price targets, timelines, or buy/sell recommendations were given.

Stablecoins

  • Stablecoins were discussed as an example of traditional financial institutions initially resisting crypto and later issuing their own products.
  • The speakers used this analogy to suggest that companies resisting AI agents may eventually adopt agent-based services rather than remain outside the market.

Takeaways

  • The investment theme is institutional adoption of crypto-linked financial products, but the transcript did not name a particular stablecoin, issuer, or investment vehicle.
  • The analogy supports a possible adoption scenario; it is not evidence that any specific stablecoin or issuer will benefit.
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Episode Description
Illia Polosukhin, Alex and Anton say the future of AI and finance is confidential and user-owned, and they think NEAR is set to lead it. In this conversation, the NEAR team explains why privacy has become a business requirement, and why open-weight models are quickly gaining ground. They also cover how NEAR hosts third-party models confidentially, and why AI agents need NEAR for reputation and civil resistance. Along the way they discuss quantum readiness, how Google built a manipulation engine, and what it takes to build a full agent economy.Illia Polosukhin is the co-founder of NEAR. Alex and Anton are part of the core NEAR team.The agentic future is being built right now.Timestamps:00:00 Intro01:14 Finance And AI Must Be Confidential By Default03:09 Zcash Led The Privacy Wave For Business07:38 Blockchain Is Finally On Par With Modern Banks11:07 NEAR Is Better Positioned Than Bitcoin For Quantum13:28 Anton Pushes Back On Justin Drake's Message17:22 Privacy Is Important For AI Not Just Finance21:46 Open Weight Models Flipped Usage In Three Months25:54 NEAR Hosting Third-Party Models Confidentially29:02 Transformation Takes Time Just Like Seatbelts34:27 Google Built A Manipulation Engine And AI Is Worse38:56 From Black Mirror To Reflective Mirror41:37 Bitcoin Proved You Can Align Capitalism With Public Good43:39 One Frontend Engineer Could Manipulate A Billion Minds46:30 Free User AI Still Needs A Business Model49:37 Agents Need NEAR For Civil Resistance And Reputation52:15 NEAR Builds The Full Agent Economy CradleGuest SocialsIllia Polosukhin X: https://x.com/ilblackdragonAlex X: https://x.com/AlexAuroraDevNEAR X: https://x.com/NEARProtocolPartners: Space and Time is providing verifiable data infrastructure for onchain finance. A decentralized database, blockchain indexer, and ZK coprocessor in one, giving DeFi protocols,stablecoins, and tokenized assets accurate, provable data. ---Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/---𝗪𝗲 𝘁𝗿𝘆 𝗼𝘂𝗿 𝗯𝗲𝘀𝘁 𝘁𝗼 𝗽𝗿𝗼𝗱𝘂𝗰𝗲 𝗵𝗶𝗴𝗵-𝗾𝘂𝗮𝗹𝗶𝘁𝘆, 𝗻𝗼𝗻-𝗯𝗶𝗮𝘀𝗲𝗱, 𝗲𝗱𝘂𝗰𝗮𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻𝗮𝗹 𝗰𝗼𝗻𝘁𝗲𝗻𝘁 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗱𝗶𝗴𝗶𝘁𝗮𝗹 𝗮𝘀𝘀𝗲𝘁𝘀 𝗲𝗰𝗼𝘀𝘆𝘀𝘁𝗲𝗺. 𝗦𝘂𝗽𝗽𝗼𝗿𝘁 𝘂𝘀 𝗯𝘆 𝗰𝗹𝗶𝗰𝗸𝗶𝗻𝗴 𝗮𝗻𝘆 𝗼𝗳 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗹𝗶𝗻𝗸𝘀 𝗯𝗲𝗹𝗼𝘄 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝗳𝗿𝗲𝗲 𝗿𝗲𝘀𝗼𝘂𝗿𝗰𝗲𝘀:Website: https://therollup.co/Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd9vbF3hJA2n7qoL5Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcastFollow us on X: https://www.x.com/therollupcoFollow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklagesFollow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyyJoin our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZhThe Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures...𝗗𝗜𝗦𝗖𝗟𝗔𝗜𝗠𝗘𝗥: 𝘐𝘯𝘷𝘦𝘴𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘪𝘯 𝘤𝘳𝘺𝘱𝘵𝘰𝘤𝘶𝘳𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘤𝘺 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘋𝘦𝘍𝘪 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮𝘴 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘦𝘴 𝘸𝘪𝘵𝘩 𝘪𝘯𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘳𝘪𝘴𝘬𝘴 𝘪𝘯𝘤𝘭𝘶𝘥𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘦𝘤𝘩𝘯𝘪𝘤𝘢𝘭 𝘳𝘪𝘴𝘬, 𝘩𝘶𝘮𝘢𝘯 𝘦𝘳𝘳𝘰𝘳, 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮 𝘧𝘢𝘪𝘭𝘶𝘳𝘦 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘮𝘰𝘳𝘦. 𝘈𝘵 𝘤𝘦𝘳𝘵𝘢𝘪𝘯 𝘱𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘵𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘳𝘰𝘶𝘨𝘩𝘰𝘶𝘵 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘤𝘩𝘢𝘯𝘯𝘦𝘭, 𝘸𝘦 𝘮𝘢𝘺 𝘦𝘢𝘳𝘯 𝘢 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘮𝘪𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘰𝘯 𝘰𝘳 𝘧𝘦𝘦 𝘢𝘴 𝘢 𝘴𝘱𝘰𝘯𝘴𝘰𝘳𝘴𝘩𝘪𝘱, 𝘪𝘧 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘪𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘤𝘢𝘴𝘦 𝘸𝘦 𝘸𝘪𝘭𝘭 𝘢𝘭𝘸𝘢𝘺𝘴 𝘮𝘢𝘬𝘦 𝘴𝘶𝘳𝘦 𝘪𝘵 𝘪𝘴 𝘤𝘭𝘦𝘢𝘳. 𝘞𝘦 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘴𝘵𝘳𝘪𝘤𝘵𝘭𝘺 𝘢𝘯 𝘦𝘥𝘶𝘤𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘢𝘭 𝘤𝘰𝘯𝘵𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮, 𝘯𝘰𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘸𝘦 𝘰𝘧𝘧𝘦𝘳 𝘪𝘴 𝘧𝘪𝘯𝘢𝘯𝘤𝘪𝘢𝘭 𝘢𝘥𝘷𝘪𝘤𝘦. 𝘞𝘦 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘯𝘰𝘵 𝘱𝘳𝘰𝘧𝘦𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘢𝘭𝘴 𝘰𝘳 𝘭𝘪𝘤𝘦𝘯𝘴𝘦𝘥 𝘢𝘥𝘷𝘪𝘴𝘰𝘳𝘴.
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