How Humans Will Earn in the AI Economy with Jordan Gray from Public AI
How Humans Will Earn in the AI Economy with Jordan Gray from Public AI
Podcast40 min 20 sec
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Note: AI-generated summary based on third-party content. Not financial advice. Read more.
Quick Insights

Focus on the decentralized data theme within the AI sector, as it offers a unique value proposition compared to commoditized compute services. Consider Public AI (PUBLIC) as a key "picks and shovels" investment, capitalizing on the growing demand for specialized, human-sourced data to train AI models. The underlying infrastructure play is NEAR Protocol (NEAR), which is attracting high-growth AI applications due to its user-friendly design and performance. Avoid decentralized compute and storage projects, as they struggle to compete with the reliability of centralized giants like AWS. For a portfolio hedge against global uncertainty, consider privacy-focused assets like Zcash (ZEC).

Detailed Analysis

AI Sector: SuperCycle vs. Bubble

  • The guest believes the current AI trend is a combination of both a bubble and a supercycle.
  • The "bubble" aspect is part of the natural Gartner Hype Cycle, where new technology gets overhyped, leading to overzealous investment and expectations.
  • The "supercycle" aspect is the underlying, long-term transformative change in the nature of technology and work, which will have lasting effects long after the bubble bursts.
  • The capital flowing in during the bubble phase is seen as a positive, as it funds massive experimentation to find real-world, product-market fit for AI technologies.

Takeaways

  • Investors should be cautious of short-term hype and inflated valuations in the AI space, acknowledging that a correction or "bursting of the bubble" is likely.
  • However, the long-term outlook for AI is exceptionally strong. The key is to invest in projects with legitimate, applied use cases that will survive the hype cycle and become foundational parts of the new economy.

Public AI (PUBLIC)

  • Public AI is a platform that pays people directly for contributing data to train AI models. It operates on a "human-in-the-loop" model.
  • It focuses on sourcing niche, on-demand data that is difficult to acquire through web scraping or synthetic generation. This includes things like audio samples in specific languages or dialects.
  • Users can earn rewards, such as USDT, for completing data campaigns. For example, a "mother tongue" campaign paid users up to $4 a day for recording short audio samples.
  • The project has a significant user base, with over 3.5 million contributors mentioned.
  • The PUBLIC token gives holders a stake in the platform, essentially allowing them to "own the shovels" they are using to mine the data. This provides governance rights and aligns incentives between the users and the platform.

Takeaways

  • Public AI represents a "picks and shovels" investment in the AI boom. As AI models become more sophisticated, their demand for high-quality, specific, and ethically sourced data will increase.
  • The PUBLIC token offers direct exposure to the growth of this data marketplace. It's a bet that decentralized, human-powered data sourcing will be a critical component of the future AI economy.
  • The project's ability to pay users directly and quickly in crypto (USDT) is a key advantage for user acquisition and retention, especially in a gig economy context.

NEAR Protocol (NEAR)

  • Public AI chose to build on the NEAR Protocol.
  • Key reasons for choosing NEAR:
    • User Experience (UX): NEAR is known for its user-friendly wallets and onboarding processes (e.g., login with Google), which is crucial for attracting non-crypto native users. The blockchain is designed to be "invisible" until the point of payment.
    • Performance: The network offers fast and cheap transactions, which is essential for a platform that needs to process a high volume of micropayments to its contributors.
    • AI Focus: The guest notes that NEAR's origins are in the AI space and the protocol is heavily focused on supporting the intersection of AI and Web3.
    • Composability: Features like NEAR intent allow for easy bridging to other ecosystems, giving users flexibility with their earned assets.

Takeaways

  • NEAR is positioning itself as a foundational infrastructure layer for consumer-facing AI and Web3 applications.
  • An investment in NEAR is a bet on its ability to attract more high-growth projects like Public AI that require both high performance and a seamless user experience to onboard millions of users from the traditional web.
  • The success of applications built on NEAR can serve as a direct catalyst for the protocol's value and adoption.

Investment Theme: Decentralized Data vs. Compute

  • The guest expressed a clear investment thesis on different sub-sectors within decentralized AI infrastructure.
  • Bullish on Decentralized Data:
    • Projects in this space (like Public AI and competitor Sapien) provide something unique and hard to replicate: niche, on-demand human data.
    • This is not a commodity. The value lies in the ability to source specific, authentic data that centralized players cannot easily access.
    • The guest sees a collaborative ecosystem forming where different decentralized data providers share deals and grow the overall market.
  • Bearish on Decentralized Compute & Storage:
    • These are viewed as commodities.
    • It is very difficult for decentralized networks to compete with centralized giants like Amazon Web Services (AWS) on reliability, uptime (SLA), and ease of use.
    • While decentralized options may be slightly cheaper, enterprise clients will likely choose the reliability and convenience of a centralized provider for these commodity services.

Takeaways

  • When evaluating investments in the decentralized AI space, focus on projects that offer a unique, non-commoditized value proposition.
  • The most promising opportunities may lie in areas where decentralization provides a distinct advantage, such as sourcing authentic global data, rather than areas that compete directly with established centralized incumbents on commodity services.

Privacy & Sovereignty Assets

  • Zcash (ZEC) and Gold were mentioned in the context of a broader trend towards privacy and sovereignty.
  • The discussion suggests that interest in these assets surges during times of greater global uncertainty.
  • People flock to them as "safe havens" when they feel a need to "hunker down" and rely less on centralized systems.
  • While acknowledged as having a "meme" component, their core value proposition is tied to sovereignty and the ability to control one's own assets privately.

Takeaways

  • Privacy-focused cryptocurrencies like Zcash (ZEC) may be viewed as a hedge against geopolitical instability and increasing surveillance.
  • These assets could see increased demand and positive price action during periods of market fear or when narratives around privacy and self-custody become more prominent.

Other Mentions

  • Palantir (PLTR): Mentioned briefly as an example of a company implementing AI in government, which could drive public awareness and concern about data privacy. This was not a direct investment recommendation but highlights a macro trend.
  • Truth Terminal: Described as a "killer use case" in the category of experimental AI agent projects on Twitter. This is a strong positive endorsement for those looking at early-stage, experimental AI projects.
  • AI Agents & MCP (Model Context Protocol): This is a forward-looking theme. MCP is described as an "API for agents," allowing different AIs to communicate and access tools. The big shift envisioned is that AIs will begin prompting humans for data, creating a new kind of labor market. Platforms like Public AI are building the infrastructure for this future machine economy.
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Episode Description
AI agents are already paying humans for their data and 3.5 million people are earning from it. In AI Supercycle episode 5, we sit down with Jordan Gray, co-founder of Public AI, to discuss how the AI economy creates new income streams for humans and why your data is more valuable than you think. We discuss: - Why Your Data Is More Valuable Than You Think - How 3.5M Users Are Already Earning From AI - The Coming Era of AI Agents Requesting Human Data - MCP: The Protocol Letting Agents Talk to Each Other - Why Decentralized Data Markets Will Win - Where AI Agents Will Source Their Training Data Timestamps 00:00 Intro 00:52 AI Supercycle or Bubble? (Where We Really Are) 02:49 The Future of Work & Labor Markets in the AI Era 04:59 How Public AI Pays Users for Their Data 08:14 Privacy in the AI Era (Can It Actually Exist?) 11:25 Data Labeling & Pipeline Infrastructure (The Hidden Economy) 16:51 Hibachi Ad, 17:00 Relay Ad, Talus Ad 17:33 Human-in-the-Loop Explained (Why AI Still Needs You) 19:42 Data Governance & Token Ownership (Who Really Owns Your Data?) 23:02 Why Public AI Chose NEAR Protocol (The Technical Decision) 27:13 Alvara Ad, Enso Ad 27:37 AI Economy & Machine Payments (How Agents Will Transact) 31:44 MCP: Model Context Protocol Explained (The AI Communication Standard) 35:15 Agents Prompting Humans, Not Vice Versa (The Role Reversal) 37:06 AI Agent Coins & VTuber Experiments (Where Culture Meets Tech) 38:58 Bullish on Data, Bearish on Commodities (Investment Thesis) Website: https://therollup.co/ Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd... Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast Follow us on X: https://www.x.com/therollupco Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup Follow Andy on X: https://www.x.com/ayyyeandy Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl ๐——๐—œ๐—ฆ๐—–๐—Ÿ๐—”๐—œ๐— ๐—˜๐—ฅ: ๐˜๐˜ฏ๐˜ท๐˜ฆ๐˜ด๐˜ต๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜จ ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ ๐˜ค๐˜ณ๐˜บ๐˜ฑ๐˜ต๐˜ฐ๐˜ค๐˜ถ๐˜ณ๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ๐˜ฏ๐˜ค๐˜บ ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ๐˜ฅ ๐˜‹๐˜ฆ๐˜๐˜ช ๐˜ฑ๐˜ญ๐˜ข๐˜ต๐˜ง๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ๐˜ฎ๐˜ด ๐˜ค๐˜ฐ๐˜ฎ๐˜ฆ๐˜ด ๐˜ธ๐˜ช๐˜ต๐˜ฉ ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜ฉ๐˜ฆ๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ๐˜ฏ๐˜ต ๐˜ณ๐˜ช๐˜ด๐˜ฌ๐˜ด ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜ค๐˜ญ๐˜ถ๐˜ฅ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜จ ๐˜ต๐˜ฆ๐˜ค๐˜ฉ๐˜ฏ๐˜ช๐˜ค๐˜ข๐˜ญ ๐˜ณ๐˜ช๐˜ด๐˜ฌ, ๐˜ฉ๐˜ถ๐˜ฎ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ ๐˜ฆ๐˜ณ๐˜ณ๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ, ๐˜ฑ๐˜ญ๐˜ข๐˜ต๐˜ง๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ๐˜ฎ ๐˜ง๐˜ข๐˜ช๐˜ญ๐˜ถ๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ๐˜ฅ ๐˜ฎ๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ. ๐˜ˆ๐˜ต ๐˜ค๐˜ฆ๐˜ณ๐˜ต๐˜ข๐˜ช๐˜ฏ ๐˜ฑ๐˜ฐ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜ต๐˜ด ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ณ๐˜ฐ๐˜ถ๐˜จ๐˜ฉ๐˜ฐ๐˜ถ๐˜ต ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ช๐˜ด ๐˜ค๐˜ฉ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ๐˜ฏ๐˜ฆ๐˜ญ, ๐˜ธ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ฎ๐˜ข๐˜บ ๐˜ฆ๐˜ข๐˜ณ๐˜ฏ ๐˜ข ๐˜ค๐˜ฐ๐˜ฎ๐˜ฎ๐˜ช๐˜ด๐˜ด๐˜ช๐˜ฐ๐˜ฏ ๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ ๐˜ง๐˜ฆ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ข๐˜ด ๐˜ข ๐˜ด๐˜ฑ๐˜ฐ๐˜ฏ๐˜ด๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ๐˜ด๐˜ฉ๐˜ช๐˜ฑ, ๐˜ช๐˜ง ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ช๐˜ด ๐˜ช๐˜ด ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ค๐˜ข๐˜ด๐˜ฆ ๐˜ธ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ธ๐˜ช๐˜ญ๐˜ญ ๐˜ข๐˜ญ๐˜ธ๐˜ข๐˜บ๐˜ด ๐˜ฎ๐˜ข๐˜ฌ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ด๐˜ถ๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ช๐˜ต ๐˜ช๐˜ด ๐˜ค๐˜ญ๐˜ฆ๐˜ข๐˜ณ. ๐˜ž๐˜ฆ ๐˜ข๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ด๐˜ต๐˜ณ๐˜ช๐˜ค๐˜ต๐˜ญ๐˜บ ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ ๐˜ฆ๐˜ฅ๐˜ถ๐˜ค๐˜ข๐˜ต๐˜ช๐˜ฐ๐˜ฏ๐˜ข๐˜ญ ๐˜ค๐˜ฐ๐˜ฏ๐˜ต๐˜ฆ๐˜ฏ๐˜ต ๐˜ฑ๐˜ญ๐˜ข๐˜ต๐˜ง๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ๐˜ฎ, ๐˜ฏ๐˜ฐ๐˜ต๐˜ฉ๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜จ ๐˜ธ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ฐ๐˜ง๐˜ง๐˜ฆ๐˜ณ ๐˜ช๐˜ด ๐˜ง๐˜ช๐˜ฏ๐˜ข๐˜ฏ๐˜ค๐˜ช๐˜ข๐˜ญ ๐˜ข๐˜ฅ๐˜ท๐˜ช๐˜ค๐˜ฆ. ๐˜ž๐˜ฆ ๐˜ข๐˜ณ๐˜ฆ ๐˜ฏ๐˜ฐ๐˜ต ๐˜ฑ๐˜ณ๐˜ฐ๐˜ง๐˜ฆ๐˜ด๐˜ด๐˜ช๐˜ฐ๐˜ฏ๐˜ข๐˜ญ๐˜ด ๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ ๐˜ญ๐˜ช๐˜ค๐˜ฆ๐˜ฏ๐˜ด๐˜ฆ๐˜ฅ ๐˜ข๐˜ฅ๐˜ท๐˜ช๐˜ด๐˜ฐ๐˜ณ๐˜ด.
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