Best Of: Zadie Smith on Populists, Frauds and Flip Phones
Best Of: Zadie Smith on Populists, Frauds and Flip Phones
Podcast1 hr 12 min
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Note: AI-generated summary based on third-party content. Not financial advice. Read more.
Quick Insights

Consider investing in utility-focused technology companies like Apple (AAPL) and Uber (UBER), whose essential services create a more durable and resilient business model. In contrast, be cautious with attention-based social media platforms like Meta (META), which face significant long-term risks from potential regulation and negative user sentiment. T-Mobile (TMUS) presents a potential growth opportunity as it aggressively targets the enterprise market with its new SuperMobile plan. The core insight suggests favoring companies that solve tangible, real-world problems over those purely competing for user attention. Finally, McDonald's (MCD) demonstrates positive responsiveness to consumer demand by reintroducing popular items like the Snack Wrap, which can foster brand loyalty.

Detailed Analysis

Social Media Platforms (Meta, X, TikTok)

  • The discussion presents a deeply critical and bearish view of social media platforms like Facebook (META), Instagram (META), X (formerly Twitter), and TikTok.
  • Author Zadie Smith describes this technology as a "behavior modification system" designed to capture attention and direct thought, rather than serve the user.
  • The sentiment is that these platforms are not neutral tools but have a specific, potentially harmful, ideology built into them. Smith states, "The system is terrible," suggesting the fundamental business model is flawed.
  • The conversation highlights the negative effects on users' ability to focus, their mental well-being, and their perception of others. Ezra Klein notes he left many platforms because "they were changing how I felt about other people."
  • There's a concern that the constant need to present a curated version of oneself online leads to a loss of a private, authentic self, which Smith describes as a "mystery to the world and which is more important to herself."

Takeaways

  • Consider the long-term risks: The podcast suggests that the core business model of the attention economy has significant negative societal side effects. For investors, this could translate into long-term risks such as:
    • Increased regulatory scrutiny.
    • Shifts in public sentiment against these platforms.
    • User burnout and abandonment of services that are perceived as mentally unhealthy.
  • Look beyond engagement metrics: While user numbers and time-on-site are key metrics, this discussion implies a qualitative risk. The quality of engagement is low, and the platforms may be creating "brain rot," which is not a sustainable foundation for a business.

Apple (AAPL) & Uber (UBER)

  • In contrast to the critique of social media, the podcast highlights the "stickiness" of utility-focused technology.
  • Ezra Klein, despite not using social media on his phone, admits he keeps his smartphone for its practical uses, specifically mentioning the ability to get directions (GPS) and order a car (Uber).
  • The host mentions Steve Jobs and the iPhone, framing the device as a portal to these essential utilities.
  • The discussion implies a distinction between technology that manipulates attention (social media) and technology that provides clear, real-world value and solves everyday problems.

Takeaways

  • Utility creates a strong moat: Companies like Apple (AAPL), whose hardware provides the gateway, and Uber (UBER), whose service provides essential utility, have a more resilient business model.
  • Ecosystem lock-in is powerful: Even users who are philosophically opposed to aspects of modern technology feel compelled to stay within the ecosystem because of its practical benefits. This creates a durable customer base.
  • Invest in problem-solvers: The insight suggests that companies focused on solving tangible, real-world problems may have a more sustainable advantage than those purely competing for user attention.

T-Mobile (TMUS)

  • This mention comes from a podcast advertisement, which presents a bullish case for the company's business offerings.
  • T-Mobile is launching "SuperMobile," described as the "first and only business plan to combine intelligent performance, built-in security, and seamless satellite coverage."
  • The ad claims T-Mobile is now the "best network" according to experts at Ookla Speedtest.
  • The focus is on capturing the competitive business market by offering a premium, feature-rich service.

Takeaways

  • Focus on business growth: T-Mobile is making a strategic push into the enterprise market with its SuperMobile plan, which could be a new avenue for growth.
  • Marketing network superiority: The company is leveraging third-party validation (Ookla) to market its network quality as a key competitive advantage. Investors should watch if this translates to market share gains, particularly in the business segment.

McDonald's (MCD)

  • An advertisement in the podcast announces that the "McDonald's Snack Wrap is back."
  • The ad highlights that the return of the product was driven by strong consumer demand ("You broke the internet for a snack").

Takeaways

  • Responsiveness to consumer demand: This is a small but relevant example of McDonald's (MCD) listening to its customer base and reintroducing a popular item. This can foster brand loyalty and drive sales.
  • Product pipeline as a catalyst: For a major consumer brand like McDonald's, menu changes and product launches are key drivers of foot traffic and sales. The return of a "fan favorite" is a positive, low-risk marketing event.
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Episode Description
This is one of my favorite conversations in recent memory — with the writer Zadie Smith.  Smith is the author of novels, including “White Teeth,” “On Beauty” and “NW,” as well as many essays and short stories. Her ability to give language to the kinds of quiet battles that live inside of ourselves is part of why she’s been one of my favorite writers for years. “We absolutely need to gather in our identity groups sometimes for our freedoms, for our civil rights. There’s absolutely no doubt about that. But for that role to be the thing that is you existentially all the way down — that is something that I personally believe all human beings revolt from at some level,” she told me when we spoke last September, shortly before  Trump’s re-election. It’s ideas like these that I found interesting to revisit now, in a starkly different political climate. In this conversation, we discuss Smith’s novel, “The Fraud,” which Smith wrote with Trump and populism front of mind; what populism is really channeling; why Smith refuses the “bait” of wokeness; how people have been “modified” by smartphones and social media; and more. This episode contains strong language. Mentioned: Feel Free by Zadie Smith “Fascinated to Presume: In Defense of Fiction” by Zadie Smith Amusing Ourselves to Death by Neil Postman “Generation Why?” by Zadie Smith Book Recommendations: The Director by Daniel Kehlmann The Rebel’s Clinic by Adam Shatz The Diaries of Virginia Woolf Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at ezrakleinshow@nytimes.com. You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs. This episode of “The Ezra Klein Show” was produced by Annie Galvin. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris, with Kate Sinclair. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota and Efim Shapiro. Our senior editor is Claire Gordon. The show’s production team also includes Rollin Hu, Elias Isquith and Kristin Lin. Original music by Isaac Jones. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The executive producer of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.
About The Ezra Klein Show
The Ezra Klein Show

The Ezra Klein Show

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